Re: Abduction by UFO. An experiment

Post by **Michael Raduga** » Mon Dec 13, 2010 1:08 am

Application for Abduction by UFO: http://ufo.obe4u.com/

Please, help to make this experiment. Post this link where you can (as joke or real - doesn't matter). Please, do not mention our site, me or my books. It works only when people do not know anything about the phase.

I will give more info, explanations and statistics later

P.S. Any practitioner must understand very easy what it is and how it works

Post by **Michael Raduga** » Mon Jan 17, 2011 5:10 am

Thanks!
In a few weeks you will see on the site an article and technique related to the link.

Post by **Michael Raduga** » Sun Aug 07, 2011 4:44 pm

It was under different domain name. It's an old test

Montana · Post by **Montana** » Sun Nov 27, 2011 12:38 am

New to the boards here...

Just wondering what became of this experiment.

-Montana

Post by **Summerlander** » Sun Nov 27, 2011 11:55 pm

It's already been done and it proved that the majority of alien abductions are a product of the phase - particularly if they relate to sleep, vibrations and paralysis. The subjects reported being taken by aliens aboard spaceships.

There have been some articles in the media about this experiment. Some were unfair though because they said it proves ALL alien abductions are the product of altered states of consciousness, and this, of course, cannot be claimed because we simply don't know.

I also had an experience were I separated from the body and was then beamed up by a huge flying saucer. Then little grey men drilled into my navel. I must say that it felt extremely real!

Jeff · Post by **Jeff** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:43 am

Summerlander,
Just curious,did you have any beliefs one way or the other before your experience? Did you sense anything about them that would indicate that they are different from other characters in the phase? And could you drop a link for the articles about this?

Also you wrote that they are a product of the phase.Whether this makes some of them real or not depends on what the phase really is doesn't it? I know we all have our opinions about whether or not the phase is just the product of brain matter,but if the phase is to be granted the status of being real somehow,then there is a chance that perhaps some of the aliens there are real too.... Then it would be entirely natural that alien encounters have strong correlations to SP and vibrations,without necessarily being the product of them...In any case,it's cool to see this type of experiment being done no matter what the ultimate truth may turn out to be.

(Personally,I'm pretty neutral on this subject 'cause I saw aliens in the phase only twice and they didn't mess with me.But it is conceivable to me that we could be like a science experiment for aliens in a way hardly imaginable to us... they could check on us like we inspect cattle..

)

Jeff · Post by **Jeff** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 1:05 am

You guys might like this thread on dreamviews no matter what you believe:

http://www.dreamviews.com/f19/galactic-school-115930/

Post by **Summerlander** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 1:20 am

Hi, Jeff!

No beliefs before experience. Before going to bed that night me and my wife had watched an episode of Stephen Spielberg's Taken and, although the aliens in my phase experience looked realer than real, they were very much like the ones from the series...only browner...

About the link with the said articles, I believe you will find them in Michael's questions thread.

I don't know what the nature of the phase is in general but it seems viable to me to think that it is our minds interpreting thoughts in the same way that it interprets the external world when we are awake. Sometimes the phase is hyper-realistic because, well, it may be information concocted in our brain cortex during sleep paralysis as opposed to information that has to travel through the nerves from sensory organs (which may cause perceived reality to be slightly duller) when we are awake.

Anyway, do I believe the aliens in my experience had an independent existence from me? No way. No way Jose!

Jeff · Post by **Jeff** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 2:44 am

Yeah,it's funny like that.What ever it is that produces the phase experience it certainly seems to make use of input from our waking world experiences.Sometimes it only needs the slightest amount of info to assemble a rich and coherent experience in a way that is a total suprise to the waking ego.

However,there are theories of the mind (backed with their own pieces of evidence) that put meaning and interpretation as part of an organism's active engagement with it's external world -so we may not really be a 'brain in vat' so to speak. In these theories the mind doesn't have to 'represent' or 'interpret' because the environment already contains the data that the organism needs.(affordances)This avoids the 'homunculus problem' -who or what is percieving the representations inside the brain.Things are largely what they seem to be and where they seem to be-spatially separate.To help explain the phase,a (HUGE) extra step could be made to accept that the environment is a continuum in which sleep could entangle us with a set of 'affordances' at a different level of organisation-mind.

This would certainly have implications for the phase if true.It would actually be a different take on why we have to maintain.(You have to engage with an environment to percieve it.)

Checkout this article to see what I mean.I doubt the author would agree with me extending it to phase experiences and dream bodies though:

http://philosophyandpsychology.com/?tag ... nce-theory

Anyway,even in the brain only idea,the content does in a sense have separate existence from our ego awareness.This is because some intelligent process has assembled and presented the ego with it's percepts in way that is beyond the ego's knowledge.We never get to see how experiences are assembled,behind the scenes,( the mind of the brain in a vat) if they are all in our heads.

Jeff · Post by **Jeff** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 2:56 am

This might be a better article:
http://acad88.sahs.uth.tmc.edu/courses/ ... dance.html

â€¢ The Complimentarity of the Organism and the Environment. For the conventional theory, perception is the processing of the retinal image formed by the stimuli in the environment. It is a one-way perception. According to Gibson, however, perception of the environment is also the perception of the self. The environment and the organism are mutually constraining and complimentary. The environment implies the organism, and vice versa

Montana · Post by **Montana** » Mon Nov 28, 2011 3:23 pm

Oh Okay... I had thought something else might be going on~

The idea that the two phenomena are connected has been around for sometime; I recall scanning through a book back in '92 that had that essential thesis. Of course, back then, (in America, at least), to acknowledge either OBE or Aliens was to put one's self well on the fringe, and I don't think that the book (who's name and author I don't recall after all these years) got much attention.

As I recall, it drew a series of parallels between UFO & alien abductions, OBE-like events, AND being abducted by leprechauns, fairies, nature spirits, etc. (This last was a common experience in previous centuries, and the author attempted to suggest that they were all the same sort of experience generally, but just perceived differently according to the perceptions that would be suggested by cultural norms and descriptions.

-Montana

BK · Post by BK » Tue Nov 29, 2011 7:09 am

It could have been Susan Blackmore.
She has a few books on this topic and cnsciousness.
I read The Meme Machine....not related to obe
The intro talks of an alien abduction case she solved...a side hobbie for her.

I also read Flim Flam... see randi.org
If I remember correctly...He proves Edgar Casey to be nothing more than probablility for his comments on Jupiter. Some other stories are incredible too.

Both authors...especially the latter...are known for debunking paranormal claims. Randi.org has yet to give away its $1,000.000 prize.

Montana · Post by **Montana** » Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:00 pm

"The Meme Machine" ... that sounds interesting!

Personally, I am remarkably uninterested in the whole UFO thing. (I say that having had too-many-to-count childhood UFO-ish experiences. Yes, some were what you would call here on this BB 'phase-related'.)

Memes are to groups what belief systems are to single individuals.

Montana

mike.henry · Post by **mike.henry** » Tue Jun 05, 2012 7:32 am

The developers of the phase state techniques this site propagates have made the assumption that because their technique can deliver certain experiences such as ufo's and NDE, all such phenomenon are the result of phase states. The assumption is fundamentally flawed. That is because they are closed minded and fundamentalist is their thinking. Their mind is not open and they can not be effectively communicated with. It is the same as saying " because eating fatty food can cause a heart attack all heart attacks are caused by fatty food" the assumption is obviously false. Subsequently I can not accept any assumptions made by the above mentioned.

Tony · Post by **Tony** » Tue Jun 05, 2012 6:47 pm

Alex Tsakiris: Letâ€™s get to the meat of their paperâ€”Iâ€™ll give you this quote: â€œContrary to popular belief, research suggests that there is nothing paranormal about these experiences. Instead, near-death experiences are the manifestation of normal brain function gone awry.â€

Post by **Summerlander** » Thu Jun 07, 2012 1:33 pm

According to the research that has been conducted using the phase state, we have enough to say that the majority of alien abduction cases are mind simulations. Note that I said the majority (realistically, if not all). I myself had an experience with alien abduction which felt real in every way. It would have convinced me had I not voluntarily entered the phase (or not known anything about it). The fact that I had watched Stephen Spielberg's Taken before bedtime also reinforces the view that the phase is largely governed by the subconscious mind and it doesn't take a genius to figure that the abduction experience was most likely influenced by watch was previously observed in the waking state.

Astralnaut · Post by **Astralnaut** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 5:31 pm

i tried to be abducted by aliens during SP, but noone came

only saw ghostly alien gray figure for a sec

Tony · Post by **Tony** » Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:24 pm

you're so ugly that you terrorized the most handsome of those ugly ets.

Barnacle · Post by **Barnacle** » Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:14 pm

Summerlander I have had experience with just about every aspect of this "phase" people here refer to and the idea that most alien abduction accounts were actually phase experiences seems completely implausible to me. For example, someone who sees a UFO then blacks out and has an abduction experience, how can that be explained as a phase experience? Did he just randomly fall unconscious and dream the whole thing? How did they get the strange marks on their body? What about people who have doctors remove surgical implants from them?

EDIT: Can you provide a link to this research you're talking about. You, like the vast majority of non scientists fail to understand what the scientific method is all about. Its all about models. Nothing is known with absolute certainty. Your argument "that most abduction accounts can be explained by phase experiences" is an extremely poor one, scientifically speaking because it can't be easily refuted by contradicting observations (i.e. even genuine alien abduction experiences could not refute an argument like that) but there are some exceptions to that, such as cases where there are physical marks and even implants left in the persons body.

Post by **Summerlander** » Sun Sep 02, 2012 5:06 pm

Can you provide a link to this research you're talking about.

LOL! A link? Where have you been? The published articles in regards to this can be found on the site if you look hard enough. Alternatively, you might want to look at the subjects database and the symptoms involved such as sleep paralysis.

If alien abductees are not lying and not crazy then they are fantasy prone and not unlike mystics. The only support these beliefs about alien abduction have come from alien enthusiasts and UFO loons - I won't even mention the questionable evidence and the outrageous conspiracy theorists.

For example, someone who sees a UFO then blacks out and has an abduction experience, how can that be explained as a phase experience? Did he just randomly fall unconscious and dream the whole thing?

People can see lights before passing out. It happens. Most of them don't even "recall" the experience until they are hypnotised. Then their imagination runs wild. Like the Hills who claimed to have been abducted by aliens from the Zeta Reticuli star system... what the media at the time conveniently ignored for sensationalist purposes was the fact that Barney's description of the aliens' eyes had featured in an episode of The Outer Limits a couple of weeks before their hypnotic sessions.

How did they get the strange marks on their body?

Good question! How did the kid get a black eye after having been to school? Did he trip over after seeing a UFO on the way home and hit the pavement? Perhaps you might want to ask now how his nose and everything came through unscathed but his eye. Or the child is not being honest about the the real origin of his bruise. All marks are strange until you know how they were made.

This could also show what lengths people go through to make their little stories more credible. Everyone wants to be taken seriously.

How did they get the strange marks on their body? What about people who have doctors remove surgical implants from them?

If you actually believe them and the sources are often questionable. Some of these so-called implants are old splinters from vehicle accidents and otherwise. Many of these stories get comically distorted in the tabloids. The "implants" are later found to be of normal chemical makeup and strongly evident of being earthly.

Thus, these alleged implants cannot be used as evidence of extraterrestrial input and this, my friend, is irrefutable.

Anyway, we are not the first ones to conclude that the phase state is responsible for many of these stories. For example, David Pritchard, a physicist who analysed many of the so-called implants concluded that most abduction experiences are actually either sleep paralysis or other kinds of frightening/bizarre experience which people then interpret as abduction because of the reading they do and the stuff they've been exposed to on the telly.

To further illustrate, there had been an intriguing implant that had aroused their curiosity for some time and got the alien abduction enthusiasts going. Finally, they got permission to subject the object to an Energy Dispersive X-ray Microanalysis - which would, beyond a shadow of a doubt - determine whether it was extraterrestrial in nature. The "implant" was found to be a mercury, tin and silver amalgam - in other words, nothing but a dental filling.

I'm not a scientist, Barnacle. Granted. But I do like to keep myself well-informed and I do take an interest. Scientists can be wrong sometimes but they are not clingy to what sounds appealing and is yet unfounded - and this is a quality I admire in them and resonates with me. It is all about sifting through the rubbish and extracting those awesome truths.

Barnacle · Post by **Barnacle** » Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:58 pm

Summerlander wrote: People can see lights before passing out. It happens. Most of them don't even "recall" the experience until they are hypnotised. Then their imagination runs wild. Like the Hills who claimed to have been abducted by aliens from the Zeta Reticuli star system... what the media at the time conveniently ignored for sensationalist purposes was the fact that Barney's description of the aliens' eyes had featured in an episode of The Outer Limits a couple of weeks before their hypnotic sessions.

This is a perfect example of someone coming up with an irrational explanation and assuming its rational because it fits their world view and is aligned with the contemporary consensus. I've read a good few posts of yours though so I know you are somewhat of a free thinker, I meant that statement generically, not specifically with respect to you. Multiple people seeing a large metallic object with lights beaming out of it and have various interactions with it such as getting burned by the heat or radiation emitted by it. Yeah thats all perfectly normal stuff that happens before spontaneously passing out. Happens to me regularly. "Memories" that surface during hypnotic regression are completely unreliable. Memories in general are volatile and subject to change via suggestion.

Summerlander wrote: Good question! How did the kid get a black eye after having been to school? Did he trip over after seeing a UFO on the way home and hit the pavement? Perhaps you might want to ask now how his nose and everything came through unscathed but his eye. Or the child is not being honest about the the real origin of his bruise. All marks are strange until you know how they were made.

Modern forensics is more than capable of determining what kind of instrument was used to create a specific mark or scar. When someone ends up with a precise incision that a modern, well equipped surgeon is incapable of replicating, it can't easily be written off as a mundane or self imposed injury. Its possible though, some people do go to extreme lengths for hoaxes. Again, this is all pure speculation because there exists no evidence to validate or refute the hypothesis that these abduction accounts are fabricated entirely in the persons mind.

Summerlander wrote: If you actually believe them and the sources are often questionable. Some of these so-called implants are old splinters from vehicle accidents and otherwise. Many of these stories get comically distorted in the tabloids. The "implants" are later found to be of normal chemical makeup and strongly evident of being earthly.

True, its unknown whether these accounts of implants removed by doctors are in any way credible. Foreign objects can travel to various parts of the body so splints is a possibility in some cases but the implants I'm referring to are ones I saw in a few documentaries which were triangular shaped objects which were supposedly wrapped in a material which is not recognised by the immune system as a foreign substance. I don't believe that an extraterrestrial race with technology vastly superior to ours would use primitive technology such as macroscopic implants. Humans have the technology to develop microscale transmitters and receivers which would be completely indetectable to the recipient. Military experimentation is a more likely explanation for many of these UFO abduction accounts in my opinion.

Summerlander wrote: Thus, these alleged implants cannot be used as evidence of extraterrestrial input and this, my friend, is irrefutable.

No my friend, it is not. Can you or anyone else prove that a foreign object removed by a body was not implanted by an extraterrestrial? No. Go to Mars and you will find the same elements of the periodic table so the fact that the material that the implant is composed of can be found on earth is not evidence that it is not of extraterrestrial origin. When a meteorite makes it through the earths atmosphere, its chemical composition is generally not very extraordinary.

Summerlander wrote:The "implant" was found to be a mercury, tin and silver amalgam - in other words, nothing but a dental filling.

Again, this proves nothing. Do you think extraterrestrials are incapable of developing an alloy similar to the ones humans develop? Maybe they had a reason to implant metal into the persons body and utilised that particular alloy because they knew that if discovered, it would be associated with a dental implant and not something of implanted there for malicious purposes. Silver happens to be the most conductive element in the periodic table, you'd be amazed at what a simple piece of metal alloy can be used for. My opinion would be that this probably is just a dental implant but I wonder how it got there. Maybe someone bit them and lost the filling in the process lol. If swallowed, a dental implant would just pass through the GI tract.

Summerlander wrote: I'm not a scientist, Barnacle. Granted. But I do like to keep myself well-informed and I do take an interest. Scientists can be wrong sometimes but they are not clingy to what sounds appealing and is yet unfounded - and this is a quality I admire in them and resonates with me. It is all about sifting through the rubbish and extracting those awesome truths.

Scientists are regularly wrong. Its all part of the process of scientific evolution. Believe it or not, most scientists too have ulterior motivations so there are no truly unbiased scientists. Different things appeal to different people. Many people who call themselves scientists are simply dogmatists. Real scientists know that they don't know and are well aware that the contemporary scientific models are just that, the contemporary scientific models and are far from infallible.

EDIT: I said all kinds of things there without providing any references at all so I'll try find articles and stuff on the various details I mentioned. I'm not really into UFOs and all that crap, I've just watched documentaries over the years but it is interesting shit I must say.

Barnacle · Post by **Barnacle** » Mon Sep 03, 2012 7:58 pm

Heres these triangular implants I was talking about:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZGC9rV9-mU
If everything they claimed in that video is true (i.e. the testing done at Los Alamos and electron microscope tests etc.), then its possibly a hoax because why would extraterrestrials plant a complex aggregate of elements (well they didn't really say anything about the chemical composition of it and I couldn't be bothered researching it too heavily) into someone. What function would it serve? If it were advanced technology, I'd assume nobody would mistake it for a piece of a meteorite but I have very little experience with analytical chemistry so I may be wrong.

I just watched this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pA9H2xVe5rQ
and at the end of the clip he says "if the suspected implant was not made on earth, a mass spectrometer would reveal isotopes not commonly found on this planet". Thats the same flawed logic I pointed out
in my previous reply. Just because a particular substance is found on earth, does not mean it can't be found on other planets. If a particular isotope is abundant on earth, its because its a stable isotope and that
has nothing to do with the environment (well there are gonna be loads of exceptions to that in the universe but I mean in other Goldie Locks zone planets or even slightly cooler planets like Mars). Lets say the
aliens are from a planet like Mars, I'm pretty sure you'll find the same isotopes on Mars, i.e. carbon 12 will be the most common carbon isotope as will oxygen-16, nitrogen-14, boron-11 etc. An unstable isotope
will be equally unstable on another planet so it will be less ubiquitous. I have no idea why they're focusing on elements, they should be focusing on the compounds present. Many compounds don't occur in nature
so the presence of an unnatural compound would indicate that it is either synthetic or of extraterrestrial origin.

BTW theres something wrong with the forums text input field, its way too wide for the box.

Post by **Summerlander** » Thu Sep 06, 2012 7:08 pm

Again, this proves nothing. Do you think extraterrestrials are incapable of developing an alloy similar to the ones humans develop? Maybe they had a reason to implant metal into the persons body and utilised that particular alloy because they knew that if discovered, it would be associated with a dental implant and not something of implanted there for malicious purposes.

But isn't this just speculation? I'm a fan of one principle, Barnacle: Occam's Razor

Many compounds don't occur in nature so the presence of an unnatural compound would indicate that it is either synthetic or of extraterrestrial origin

Many compounds need to be synthesized. You're right. In fact, they are synthesized and studied. Like boron hydrides as potential fuel for rockets. It is a human trait to explore the many uses of compounds. Hypothetically, the purpose of extraterrestrial devices made from compounds would be as alien to us as their appearance or presence. Silver is certainly a great conductor and we know that and use that to our advantage. Would aliens do the same? Just because silver is a great conductor and is found in some alleged implants still doesn't mean a thing. The point is that we can easily manufacture them.

I've been through many links with videos and documents proclaiming many things about UFOs and aliens, and conspiracy theorists gunning for recognition... the full works!! I've had countless debates about it - having seen a couple of UFOs myself - but I still don't think that we are being visited by aliens or that they are amongst us. I believe that the mass hysteria for UFOs and alien abduction stems from pop culture coupled with phase states of the brain. In this day and age, it is very fitting and it has certainly replaced angel/demon visitations.